i'm embarking here on a risky post
one that could engender harsh feelings and responses
may even upset a 'friendship' .. or 3
i hope not
i intend on posting several things of like nature
not at all to be offensive
but to express myself on theological stuff
stuff that concerns the person of God
as i walk down this road of rethinking my 'theology'
and i want you to be in on it with me
please comment as you see fit
i welcome it
i'm open
i'll make every attempt to review and edit as much as necessary
to get the point across as clearly as possible
= say precisely what i have in my mind ..
i may not succeed at 1st shot
cause i can't think of everything upfront
but i'll try ...
prelude and aside-but-relevant
unless we are willing to test our 'theology'
as in open it up to challenge
be open to discussion
and other points of view
listen to others' take on it ...
then we are of all men most arrogant
and arrogance has no place in kingdomlife ...
it was the original fail of lucifer
who imagined he could be God
end prelude and aside-but-relevant
...........
topic - 'inclusivism'point - i hate words like this, used for this purpose
a definitive word like this often gathers associations and meanings slanted one way or another
especially in theology where argumentation and conflict are rife
and ends up engendering all sorts of negative implications
before you even get to discuss the topic
so i'll try to define precisely what i'm talking about
and talk about it to define it
before i give the theological definition that most closely fits my thinking
which i found at theopedia.com
(and with whom i probably do not agree in several various areas)
i'll try to say it my way
in a nutshell ...
a person who believes in a Creator God
through whatever revelation they have
recognizes the divine otherness of that Creator God
and recognizes their own mortal limitations as created being
and worships Creator God from the heart
according to the understanding they have
knows God
albeit imperfectly
and is accepted by God
regardless of whether or not they have ever heard of Jesus
-- - -- --- ----- -- -
i'm dodging bullets ...
but that's my take on it ...
i know i know
it cuts deep into my (your ?) traditional theology
runs anti to it
but ...
i'm on this journey of rethink/reconsider/retheothink
and virtually everything is fair game
here's the
what brought me to this today
is an article i read at huffington post in their religion section
go here ..
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/22/10-facts-global-religion_n_4117341.html?utm_hp_ref=religion
i've thought about and discussed this several times in the last couple years
so maybe it's time to put it out there
please don't diss' me upfront ..
after all .. i could be wrong ...
here's the definition according to theopedia.com
found here http://www.theopedia.com/Inclusivism
" Inclusivism posits that even though the work of Christ is the only means of salvation, it does not follow that explicit knowledge of Christ is necessary in order for one to be saved. In contrast to pluralism, inclusivism agrees with exclusivism in affirming the particularity of salvation in Jesus Christ. But unlike exclusivism, inclusivism holds that an implicit faith response to general revelation can be salvific. God expects from man a response proportional to the light given. Saving faith is not characterized so much by its cognitive content as it is by its reverent quality. "
looking at the article and map
i see a couple things
first 'christianity' is dominant
'islam' close behind
i
and probably you
if you are evangelical or fundementalist or calvinist/reformed
or roman catholic or orthodox or anglican/episcopalean or whatever ...
don't really accept the statistics on 'christianity'
according to my/our theology ...
as point 3 in the article states
'Most People Are Part Of Religious Majorities In Their Countries'
point 6
'Christianity Is A Majority In Over 100 Countries'
point 9
'Christianity Dominates A Majority Of The World's Regions'
i never considered that people born into a religion
or a country defined by that religion
are 'saved'
still don't
one can be born and reared in a 'christian' nation
raised in a 'christian' church
and be very anti-christ
check history
so then
points to consider
- didn't Jesus say that to get to the Father a person has to go through him ? (John 14.6)
- there's the famous 'great commission' of Matthew 28
- apostle peter said there's no other human name by which a person can be saved (Acts 4.12)
- at Romans 10 apostle Paul talks about people calling on the name of the Lord to be saved
and the blessedness of the feet of those who take the good news
etc etc etc
agreed
that's scripture
however please note the context
everything springs out of context
the context of Jesus' ministry was ' to the jew first '
he came to his own but they didn't receive him
but whoever received him (whether jew or non-jew)
he gives the right to become God's children
the promises were through israel to the world
first to his own people
those chosen by God to represent him in the earth
then outward from there
so what was said by Jesus
and the context of romans 10 and peter in Acts
as examples
are in the context of israel
they have to recognize Jesus as messiah
long promised
now on the scene
even though he doesn't fit their preconceptions ...
there's noone else coming
he is the one
and besides that
the day of israel's privilege is over ...
following on israels' failure to be YHWH's representatives in the earth
Messiah will be a light to the gentiles too
It is not enough for you to be My Servant
raising up the tribes of Jacob
and restoring the protected ones of Israel.
I will also make you a light for the nations,
to be My salvation to the ends of the earth. (Isaiah 49.6)
the context was promised Messiah
in each example
a more engaging contexting passage is Romans 1 and 2
2 in particular
there the plan of God for humanity is laid out
revelation
first in the form of nature ...
the magnificence of nature reveals a divine hand
a powerful creator
and speaks powerfully of the Godhead
it's natural for a person to see in creation the obvious implication of a creator
and that the creation includes them
and that creator must be massively more powerful
infinitely more wise
to have accomplished it that creator must be divine
to deny this natural understanding is
according to the author
a willful act
God speaks to the human mind through creation
further to that
there is a conscience issue
and a Law issue
israel
as elected by God to represent him in the earth
were 'privileged' by Law
God gave them instructions on life
and worship
and sacrifice and atonement ...
all they needed to know him
and to please him
in their context
at that stage in history
but
he didn't leave the other nations hopeless
every person has a conscience
and God saw to it that the effect of Law given to israel
was written on the conscience of everyone
so that when the unLawed in effect responded to Law
through the witness of their conscience
they spoke to their own accountability
whether they obeyed the dictates of their conscience or not ...
they were guilty or innocent according to their own conscience
read Romans 2
a person cannot be judged according to what they don't know
israel had conscience too ...
but God formalized the rule of conscience as Law for them
to hold each one publicly accountable for the elect nature of their covenant with him
that is
when an israelite broke Law it was clear to all israel
... ...
finally the ultimate revelation of God
the man Messiah Jesus
who came for reconciliation
for the jew
for the non-jew-gentile
for the cosmos
Hebrews 1 states it well
2 In these last days, He [God] has spoken to us by His Son. God has appointed Him heir of all things and made the universe through Him. 3 The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact expression of His nature, sustaining all things by His powerful word. After making purification for sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high.
and in the context of the privilege of elect israel
apostle paul says at romans 3
21 But now, apart from the law, God’s righteousness has been revealed—attested by the Law and the Prophets 22 —that is, God’s righteousness through faith in Jesus Christ, to all who believe, since there is no distinction. 23 For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. 24 They are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
this ultimate expression
of the person of God
the character of God
the love of God
has become our flesh
our brother
our redeemer
our salvation
our hope
our peace
our representative at God's own right hand
marvelous ...
so then
all men are left without excuse
read Romans 3
jew and gentile-non-jew ...
every person will be held accountable
according to the revelation he personally has
creation
Law
conscience
Messiah Jesus
the holy scriptures that speak to all of this
the witness of the church
the body of Messiah
any combination
any nation
any religion
any person
all persons
all nations
all religions
throughout history
God will judge people based on the light they themselves had ...
fair
evenhanded
just
that is the God of the scriptures
expressed perfectly in Messiah Jesus
selah ..~
take that proverbial native of some far-removed land
who has never heard of Jehovah God or bible or Jesus ...
all he knows is life in the raw
spearing his food
building his hut-shelter
protecting his family and village
when he goes about life
sees the stars and the animals and the crops growing
sees nature in its awesome beauty
he knows instinctively that someone made it all
someone far more poweful than he is
if he looks to worship that being
submitting himself as best he knows how ....
does God not accept him ?
i quote from Romans 2 -
6 He will repay each one according to his works: 7 eternal life to those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor, and immortality; 8 but wrath and indignation to those who are self-seeking and disobey the truth but are obeying unrighteousness; 9 affliction and distress for every human being who does evil, first to the Jew, and also to the Greek; 10 but glory, honor, and peace for everyone who does what is good, first to the Jew, and also to the Greek. 11 There is no favoritism with God.
12 All those who sinned without the law will also perish without the law, and all those who sinned under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For the hearers of the law are not righteous before God, but the doers of the law will be declared righteous.
14 So, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, instinctively do what the law demands, they are a law to themselves even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts.
Their consciences confirm this. Their competing thoughts will either accuse or excuse them 16 on the day when God judges what people have kept secret, according to my gospel through Christ Jesus.
my take on apostle paul's comments here
is that a person who desires to know that divine creator being
and acts according to their conscience
will reap 'eternal life' as per v7
argument - if that's so
why then do we need to tell people about Jesus ?
because it's the truth
the wonderful truth
because he is the full and complete revelation of God ..
want to know what God is like
look at Jesus ...
he is the defining reconciliation of God for this broken world
a world that every person knows is wrong and bent and evil and needs fixing ...
how could you not witness to that in your life
so we are to display to the world the wonder of God's reconciliation in Jesus
but the person who never has the opportunity to know that is not without hope
because God is just and judges fairly
if you know the Law you will be judged by the Law
if you know the 'gospel' you will be judged by that
if you know by conscience you will be judged accordingly
God will not judge a person by what they don't know
but by the light they had
and their response to that light
that argument that " if that's so why do i need to become a christian "
fails for 1 simple reason ...
you know ...
and if you don't yet know
by the end of this blogpost
you will
and you are held accountable for what you know ...
ipso facto your trying to be 'smart' fails ...
besides
seems you were simply looking for an excuse anyway ...
no man is excusable
not one
not
one
we are left with the 'great commission' ...
it is incumbent upon us to spread the good news
the wonderful truth that Creator God has begun the reconciliation of all things
setting right the wrongness of our world system
he is doing it through the person of Messiah Jesus
and one day all will be reconciled
everything in the cosmos
and God will be all in all
as his children
we are his ambassadors wherever we go
messengers of the good news
our responsibility is to be light wherever we go
that does not translate into
every single person who has not known
will forever be separated from God
at least according to my view of it
i've written enough on this for now
more later
prolly
shalom
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